personal attacks : when they have no more arguments...

[deeds]

After Homayoun understood that an EXP file is not a BIN book :

...
So a match between a book and experience file is meaningless
...

When Sedat never understand it :

...
I disagree if 'someone' who will say here 'meaningless' about
If we are running such as Duel matches: Book vs Experience!
...

...
What I can say more and more all over these issues,
It's all in our hands, when I say all, a fast hardware is required!
...

Wrong ! Despite a huge power gap :

They only had draws for 3 consecutive days Try again !

[deeds]

Is it possible for engine in learning mode to find a brilliant move that nobody else has never noticed it brfore( innovation) ?

Yes, it often happen at training, it is the goal too !

When non-learning engines plays against non-learning engines, nothing allows/force them to select an another move than their bestmoves. So they often produce the same lines, the same moves in the same key positions, etc. They are very predictable.

When learning engines plays against learning engines, they try the 3rd or 4th bestmove until they find a line that is more effective than the 1st or 2nd bestmove. They rarely produce the same lines, the same moves in the same key positions, etc. They are increasingly unpredictable.

[deeds]

Let me ask my question in other way:
Suppose an engine like clover ( not stockfish family). Can the version 6 of clover with experience file and also skilled trainer be even stronger than version 8 of clover which uses a different and new NNUE net( but without exp file).
Thanks in advance
Note: stronger here : means having more positional knowledge and better performance.

Yes it's possible because the learned moves are loaded into the engine's hash so :
- the engine remembers the winning/losing/draw lines without having to reanalyze them
- the engine knows what the most probable endgame's material so the engine will avoid/favor certain exchanges in order to keep these pieces
- etc.

[deeds]

you can find all the tools here in this forum and creating a bin book is very easy.

Good luck to use an EXP file with contains Eman's scores with SF-FB from 09/28/24 !

[Homayoun]

And my last question
Do you think experience file is more useful for the NNUE engines that are updated very late? (For example koivisto engine hasn’t been updated for more than one year)? or it can be useful even for NNUE engines which are updated very soon. ( for example we have new version every 3-4 month with lots of changes in source code including new net,evaluation,etc. )?
Thanks in advance

[Sedat Canbaz]

@ to Honest and Experienced People

When Losers, of course will be 'meaningless' already!
Eh..in the end, 2nd League players...

Sure when anyone (with strong EXP) is ready for Super League,
Just Let Me know please..I really wonder what will be results!

But till to this date,
I strongly recommend harder work, there is nothing impossible!
Believe it or not...

A small note more (about my previous posting),
I was referring that to be successful, to produce many games, train etc
In short, it's required a fast hardware such as with many many cores!
But I hardly doubt that amateurs will understand what I mean again...

And this time hope helps )

[Martin_1969]

Good luck to use an EXP file with contains Eman's scores with SF-FB from 09/28/24 !

Oh boy, what are YOU talking about?
BYE

[deeds]

Do you think experience file is more useful for the NNUE engines that are updated very late ?
Or it can be useful even for NNUE engines which are updated very soon ?

For both !

At each new net, Stockfish makes fewer mistakes against itself but none of its nets allows Stockfish to win all openings at each time.
There is a variability in the Stockfish strength even with the same hardware / tc / net.

At each new training, a learning engine memorize the most efficient lines (and the lines to avoid) for a given opening.
Thanks to its EXP file, a learning engine will use them regardless of the hardware / tc / nets there is less variability.

Here, you can see few experiments :
- tc odd - eman exp vs sf15
- SF15.1 at TC 60+1 vs Eman exp. at fixed depth

Here, you can see the difference when the learning engine is helped or not by a (reinforced) EXP file :
- TC 1m+1s vs TC 6m+6s (with EXP file)
- TC 1m+1s vs TC 6m+6s (without EXP file)

[deeds]

Good luck to use an EXP file with contains Eman's scores with SF-FB from 09/28/24 !

Oh boy, what are YOU talking about?
BYE

viewtopic.php?f=38&t=4173&start=50#p37871
You said you had good performance with SF-PB with a book created from Eman/C-dragon games.
But you didn't try the same engine (=SF-PB) with the EXP file created by Eman during these same games.
That's why i answered : "Good luck to use an EXP file with a non-learning engine (=SF-PB) which has different evaluation than the engine used to create the EXP file (=Eman)

[Homayoun]

Ok. Thanks for answers.
Have good times