Big applause for Light 24 (Eduard Nemeth)

[Bobbygrom]

Dear forum members,

The possibilities of using Stockfish 16.1 for the analysis of (tactical) game positions are discussed in various places. Not everyone is satisfied with this, but there is also discussion about how that relates to playing strength in regular games.

Below you will find an overview based on hundreds of analyzes from the past two years. I use the EN-Test-2023 to get an impression of the effectiveness of engines in tactical positions. I do that with my laptop: AMD Ryzen 7 4800H with Radeon Graphics, 2.90 GHz (16.0 GB (15.4 GB available)), NVIDIA Geforce GTX 1660 Ti.

In the table you only see a limited number of outcomes, the columns mean the following:
1. Pick order (ranking number engine)
2. Test date
3. Test name
4. Engine name (with some additional information)
5. Processor
6. Thread(s)
7. Time control
8. Result
9. Dissolution rate
10. Average resolution time

Pick order Test-datum Test Engine (AVX2) Processor Threads Time-control Resultaat Perc. Oplostijd
1 Test 2024 03 05 EN-Test-2023 Light 24 (RandomMultiPV 3) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 97 uit 110 88,2% 09.92 / 21.92
3 Test 2024 03 06 EN-Test-2023 Light 22 (RandomMultiPV 3) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 96 uit 110 87,3% 11.17 / 21.66
6 Test 2024 03 06 EN-Test-2023 Leptir Ultra jan 2024 22 januari (RandomMultiPV 4) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 94 uit 110 85,5% 10.43 / 15.50
9 Test 2024 03 05 EN-Test-2023 Cool Iris 11.90 (RandomMultiPV 4) (0 exp) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 93 uit 110 84,5% 09.33 / 17.55
10 Test 2024 01 26 EN-Test-2023 Leptir Ultra jan 2024 22 januari amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 93 uit 110 84,5% 10.70 / 16.11
11 Test 2024 01 07 EN-Test-2023 SF Corrchess 4 versie 01 01 24 (RandomMultiPV 5) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 93 uit 110 84,5% 11.47 / 18.04
13 Test 2024 01 02 EN-Test-2023 Cool Iris 11.80 + blanco exp file (RandomMultiPv 5) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 93 uit 110 84,5% 12.52 / 18.24
18 Test 2023 12 11 EN-Test-2023 Cool Iris 11.70 + 10 K exp file (zelf opgebouwd) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 92 uit 110 83,6% 09.69 / 17.39
19 Test 2024 02 10 EN-Test-2023 Leptir 7 februari 2024 (RandomMultiPV 5) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 92 uit 110 83,6% 09.98 / 16.49
23 Test 2024 02 16 EN-Test-2023 Light 20 Big (RandomMultiPV 4) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 91 uit 110 82,7% 09.33 / 19.39
34 Test 2024 03 13 EN-Test-2023 Incognito 7 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 89 uit 110 80,9% 08.61 / 18.52
43 Test 2023 09 16 EN-Test-2023 Corrchess 4 versie 16 september 2023 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 87 uit 110 79,1% 09.56 / 21.47
44 Test 2023 08 01 EN-Test-2023 Corrchess 4 versie 1 augustus 2023 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 86 uit 110 78,2% 07.97 / 19.97
49 Test 2023 09 04 EN-Test-2023 Sun 1.1 2560 04 sept 23 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 83 uit 110 75,5% 08.56 / 19.62
55 Test 2023 12 30 EN-Test-2023 Incognito IV Pro amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 81 uit 110 73,6% 08.19 / 19.41
62 Test 2023 09 06 EN-Test-2023 Sun SE 06 sept 23 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 79 uit 110 71,8% 08.17 / 18.91
64 Test 2023 10 30 EN-Test-2023 Incognito III amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 79 uit 110 71,8% 09.74 / 18.48
65 Test 2024 03 14 EN-Test-2023 BIG-SF versie 14032024 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 79 uit 110 71,8% 09.94 / 21.74
66 Test 2023 11 18 EN-Test-2023 Cool Iris 11.50 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 78 uit 110 70,9% 08.64 / 18.98
67 Test 2024 02 15 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish 16.3 (15 februari 2024) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 78 uit 110 70,9% 09.08 / 22.07
68 Test 2023 11 03 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish (3 november 2023) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 78 uit 110 70,9% 10.73 / 21.92
69 Test 2023 08 24 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish 16.2 (exp elarge net 24 aug) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 77 uit 110 70,0% 06.68/ 19.48
70 Test 2023 11 20 EN-Test-2023 Incognito IV amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 77 uit 110 70,0% 08.14 / 19.53
71 Test 2023 1209 EN-Test-2023 Cool Iris 11.60 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 77 uit 110 70,0% 08.49 / 20.02
72 Test 2024 02 14 EN-Test-2023 Brainlearn 27 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 76 uit 110 69,1% 07.41 / 21.59
76 Test 2024 03 13 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish versie 12032024 - 3072 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 76 uit 110 69,1% 09.68 / 21.47
77 Test 2023 08 17 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish 16.0 (16 augustus) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 76 uit 110 69,1% 09.84 / 21.53
78 Test 2023 07 20 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish 16.2 (exp extra large net) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 75 uit 110 68,2% 06.66 / 19.85
79 Test 2023 11 05 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish (4 november) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 75 uit 110 68,2% 08.31 / 21.72
80 Test 2023 06 20 EN-Test-2023 Corrchess 4 versie juni amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 75 uit 110 68,2% 08.87 / 20.73
81 Test 2023 05 19 EN-Test-2023 Crystal 6 PMT amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 74 uit 110 67,3% 06.70 / 17.24
82 Test 2023 09 03 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish 16.0 (3 september 2023) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 74 uit 110 67,3% 07.57 / 21.16
83 Test 2023 11 11 EN-Test-2023 Brainlearn 26.2 (exp file na grote test 10 sec) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 74 uit 110 67,3% 07.87 / 20.12
84 Test 2023 05 21 EN-Test-2023 Little Beast 2 sl 21-05 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 74 uit 110 67,3% 08.07 / 23.29
85 Test 2023 05 28 EN-Test-2023 Swordfish 4 (15.4 mei) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 74 uit 110 67,3% 08.36 / 22.68
86 Test 2023 04 17 EN-Test-2023 Charisma Diamond amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 74 uit 110 67,3% 10.79 / 22.01
87 Test 2023 06 24 EN-Test-2023 Corrchess 4 versie 24 augustus 2023 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 73 uit 110 66,4% 06.92 / 20.76
88 Test 2023 08 24 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish 16.0 (24 augustus 2023) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 73 uit 110 66,4% 07.15 / 20.57
89 Test 2023 10 31 EN-Test-2023 Brainlearn 26.1 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 73 uit 110 66,4% 07.79 / 20.91
90 Test 2023 06 24 EN-Test-2023 Corrchess 4 versie 19 juni 2023 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 73 uit 110 66,4% 08.32 / 20.60
91 Test 2023 04 12 EN-Test-2023 Crystal 5 KWK amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 73 uit 110 66,4% 08.67 / 17.65
92 Test 2023 07 10 EN-Test-2023 Corrchess 4 versie 6 juli (708) 2023 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 73 uit 110 66,4% 09.82 / 20.49
93 Test 2023 06 07 EN-Test-2023 Leptir analyzer (6 juni) 2023 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 73 uit 110 66,4% 10.11 / 21.09
94 Test 2023 05 16 EN-Test-2023 Little Beast 2 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 73 uit 110 66,4% 10.23 / 23.91
95 Test 2023 05 15 EN-Test-2023 Little Beast amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 73 uit 110 66,4% 10.94 / 24.84
96 Test 2023 11 08 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish (7 november 2023) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 72 uit 110 65,5% 04.83 / 20.73
97 Test 2023 11 11 EN-Test-2023 Crystal 7 PMT amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 72 uit 110 65,5% 05.28 / 16.02
98 Test 2023 10 31 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish (30 okotber 2023) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 72 uit 110 65,5% 07.05 / 19.13
99 Test 2023 07 20 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish 16.2 (exp large net 2023) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 72 uit 110 65,5% 07.13 / 19.69
100 Test 2024 01 01 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish (1 januari 2024) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 72 uit 110 65,5% 07.25 / 20.36
101 Test 2023 12 01 EN-Test-2023 Brainlearn 26.5 (blanco exp) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 72 uit 110 65,5% 08.82 / 20.75
102 Test 2023 06 06 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish (6 juni 2023) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 72 uit 110 65,5% 09.94 / 22.63
103 Test 2023 07 01 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish 16.1 (7 juli 2023) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 72 uit 110 65,5% 10.49 / 21.95
104 Test 2023 06 11 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish (6 juni 2023) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 72 uit 110 65,5% 10.77 / 22.65
105 Test 2023 05 28 EN-Test-2023 Corchess 4 versie 28 mei 2023 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 71 uit 110 64,5% 07.84 / 21.74
106 Test 2023 06 28 EN-Test-2023 Swordfish 4 (15.5) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 71 uit 110 64,5% 08.08 / 21.19
107 Test 2023 1202 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish (2 december 2023) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 71 uit 110 64,5% 08.67 / 20.09
108 Test 2024 03 14 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish versie 14032024 - last original version 2024 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 71 uit 110 64,5% 09.38 / 20.91
109 Test 2023 08 17 EN-Test-2023 Beast 1.0 sl amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 71 uit 110 64,5% 11.52 / 20.61
110 Test 2023 06 23 EN-Test-2023 Shaschess GZ EXT avx amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 70 uit 110 63,6% 07.40 / 20.32
111 Test 2023 05 14 EN-Test-2023 Shaschess 32 amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 70 uit 110 63,6% 08.09 / 20.54
112 Test 2023 04 18 EN-Test-2023 Charisma Diamond II amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 70 uit 110 63,6% 09.59 / 22.60
113 Test 2023 04 25 EN-Test-2023 Stockfish (versie 25 april 2023) amdryzen/nvidia 1 60 sec / move 70 uit 110 63,6% 10.45 / 23.68

Apologies that the table is not properly aligned everywhere. There are some striking results:

1. Light 24 is in first place with a percentage of 88.2%.
2. The first Stockfish version is in 67th place with a percentage of 70.9%.
3. The most current version of Stockfish ranks 108th with a percentage of 64.5%.

I think this is really worth applause for the creator of Light 24 (Eduard Nemeth). Why? Light 24 is a Stockfish dev and some say Eduard only changed some parameters. He himself says that he has also made code adjustments that he borrowed from the CorrChess engine and he uses alternative networks. It doesn't really matter to me how Eduard accomplishes this, but I admire his work. His Light 24 version is the analysis engine for me for the dubious openings that I play at my club.

I understand very well that solving tactical positions is not directly comparable to playing entire games. Building and expanding small advantages move by move towards a possible profit position certainly requires different qualities and settings in an engine. But this does raise the question of how would Light 24 fare in a real match against Stockfish version 14032024 - last original version 2024?? I am considering organizing that to give the discussion a better empirical basis. Unfortunately I don't have much chess program knowledge to do this in an efficient way. But I think it would be interesting to have such a Rapid match (30 min + 5 sec) to get an impression of how a tactical monster can hold its own against the best chess program in the world, which is much less tactical. Who else is curious?

Kind regards, Gosse

[Cengiz-Baba]

Hello, Gosse,

I read your explanations carefully and I agree with your curiosity. Frankly, I'm curious too. I can test it in my own way, but where can I download Light24? If you know, you can write to me. Mail or from this site.

Best regards,
Fringe.

[Bobbygrom]

Tommorrow I will ask Eduard because it is his private engine and he carefull with the distribution.

[Triton6654]

In general, the criticism for Eduard's Stockfish mod is tat they r good at solving puzzles but perform badly when playing other engines..

However, the recently mod using dimension 3072 NNUE network look very promising..

U may want to test out Big-SF with nn-8747f5ce199f.nnue..
https://tests.stockfishchess.org/api/nn ... e199f.nnue

Download Big-SF 150324, Win 64-Bit (avx2, avx512, bmi2, sse41, source code):
https://pixeldrain.com/u/onhHKCZY

[Ghppn]

Thanks a lot, Triton6654!

[Bobbygrom]

Hi Fringe,

Here under stekt the reaction from Eduard:

" When it comes to tactical analysis, this engine is at the top of my list, tested with my ENET-2023 test.
I don't know what purpose a match against another engine should have? Light 24 uses MultiPV=2 and that's what I have
optimized for analytics, not gaming. Nevertheless, you are welcome to give this engine to Fringe to test.

Have fun!

LG Edward"

Would you sent me a mail to exchange the Light 24 engine (g.romkes@chello.nl).

Best regards, Gosse

[Indian15]

Eduard Nemeth is a AGM and have lot of knowledge about chess so he makes very good engines but they are private and shoves them up his.
What is the use for chess community in doing that?

[Triton6654]

EN-Test-2023, care to share this file with all the brothers in this forum?

[Bobbygrom]

This is the link for the ERET test. Eduard changed a few positions but you can use this for now":

https://glarean-magazin.ch/2017/03/05/c ... test-eret/

[Bobbygrom]

And here is the ENET-2023 test.

Let me know the results of your testing.

BR Gosse